Talk:Akabar Bel Akash

CoAB (game) timeline
Hello. I see that you're using the game's reference and timeline to describe Akabar Bel Akash's journeys. Can you please let me know where you got this information from, either the game itself, the cluebook, the manual, or the adventurer's journal? Considering that the video game's timeline hugely differs from that of the novels (and modules), I don't think the game is applicable here as a reference. If I remember correctly, Alias is 6 years old in the game, so the date would be approximately 1363 DR. I know that directly conflicts with his death and numerous other conflicts, so we should probably figure out the canonicity of the Pool of Radiance series before we use them as references. Thanks. ~ Possessed Priest (talk) 02:08, July 21, 2020 (UTC)


 * The only info that's game exclusive is the age (the only ref of the actual number, apart from implying was going to be too old to adventure in Hall of Heroes) and quarterstaff in inventory (bother from the game proper). The general story, the locations, and villains are virtually identical to the CotAB adventure that takes place a few months after the book (CotAB published adventure p3). The same adventure also says that it is the version of the game with some differences (p3). So i prioritize the Adventure's canon to the game's, where applicable. Artyom.pavlov (talk) 03:39, July 21, 2020 (UTC)


 * I'm talking about the greater canon, here. Please note: the module and game timeline do not fit in with the novel timeline. I'll try to explain that now, and how it is related to Pool of Radiance:


 * The novel, Pool of Radiance, takes place in 1340 DR (originally it was around the same time as Curse of the Azure Bonds). As we discussed before, this was a retcon to do with the Time of Troubles.


 * The novel, Azure Bonds, takes place in 1357 DR. This was not retconned (certainly not the same time shift in any case), causing inherent issues in the timeline for all products relating Pool of Radiance to (Curse of the) Azure Bonds, which are related to each other, in all cases but the novel.


 * So, we see there is a ~ 17 year gap. Is it possible that the module, Curse of the Azure Bonds, takes place in this timeline? No, it is not possible. See page 3 of the module: "These events" (Azure Bonds) "took place during Mirtul and Kythorn, four months ago". Now this is the important part: "At about the same time, a group of adventurers in Phlan... discovered the Pool of Radiance and its malefic protector, the daemon Tyranthraxus." Clearly, these events took place at a similar time, but 1340 DR is not at all close to 1357 DR – it certainly isn't a few months away.


 * The separate timelines seem as follows:
 * Novels: PoR (1340 DR), AB (~1357 DR). Unrelated.
 * Modules: PoR (~1357/8 DR), CoAB (~1357/8 DR). Related: a few months apart. Though if we reconcile these dates, PoR should be in 1340 DR and CoAB should be about this time too. Obviously, that doesn't work. It doesn't work the other way, as well.
 * Video Games: PoR (~1357/1358 DR), CoAB (~1363 DR iirc, but could be closer to the module's timeline). Related: same set of heroes, a few years apart.


 * Clearly, these events don't really follow our canon hierarchy (the events don't take place at the same point of time at all, so they temporally conflict), and it is logical to take the novel timeline as canon. According to our canon policy: "A retcon should always be considered to override any information in the source material, provided it is from a TSR or Wizards source."


 * "Apply the canon hierarchy anyway". Ok, let's try that.
 * We find the most recent sourcebook in the Forgotten Realms campaign setting that describes the events. As far as I'm aware, this is the Grand History of the Realms, which places the events of PoR in 1340 DR and CoAB in 1358 DR.


 * PoR: 1340 DR. Tyranthraxus, the Possessing Spirit, claims the Pool of Radiance. From the corrupted body of a bronze dragon, Tyranthraxus assumes control of the Ruins of Phlan, and rules from beneath Valjevo Castle until he is defeated by adventurers.


 * AB: 1358 DR. The god Moander returns to the Forgotten Vale and takes control of this saurial settlement, but is driven back into the planes by Alias and friends. Finder Wyvernspur, The Nameless Bard, destroys Moander and becomes a demipower.


 * Ok, so according to the highest possible tier of the hierarchy, they are 18 years apart. Modules come next (though they are not recent): CoAB takes place a few months after the events of PoR. This of course, makes no sense. The timelines are completely different in every way, making out as if the modules and video games were not meant to be canon. This is why I wanted to start the discussion (as I did on the other Talk page), as it doesn't make sense to have these events in the same timeline. ~ Possessed Priest (talk) 12:22, July 21, 2020 (UTC)


 * And to make it even more confusing the events of CotAB are mentioned in Tyranthraxus entry in the Villain's Lorebook (it also did not differentiate between ruins of adventure and pool of rad)Artyom.pavlov (talk) 12:55, July 21, 2020 (UTC)