Talk:Guenhwyvar

Guenhwyvar a Minor Artifact?
Here is a quote from the Dungeon Master's Guide (3rd edition): "Minor artifacts are not necessarily unique items. Instead, they are magic items that no longer can be made, at least by common mortal means."

From the 4th edition DMG: "Artifacts are unique, named magic items whose creation or existence can't be explained by the normal laws of magic. ... An artifact cn't be created, disenchanted, or destroyed by any of the normal means available for other magic items. ... Artifacts are sentient - although they're not necessarily communicative - and they have their own motivations."

Guenhwyvar definitely fits both descriptions, especially the latter's. If you read "Guenhwyvar" (the first story in Realms of Magic), her creation is definitely out-of-the-ordinary, and not even explainable by her creator and first possessor. She's most definitely sentient and has her own motivations - just ask Masoj Hun'ett.

"Bazaar of the Bizarre: The Items of the Drizzt Saga" (Dragon #386) classifies her statuette as a "wondrous item", which the Adventurer's Vault describes as: "Wondrous items include a hodgepodge of trinkets, devices, and oddities that can't be placed within the normal equipment slots."

I think to describe her as a "trinket" or "device" is to not do her justice. What does everyone else think? Cronje (talk &sdot; contribs) 22:50, August 13, 2011 (UTC)


 * As far as I'm aware Guenhwyvar does not exhibit any of the typical properties of an artifact. It is not a unique item (as one of the many figurines of wonderous power), it can be damaged and even lose its enchantment.


 * The only unique feature is the creature it summons, guen. Which in iself is not really an artifact worthy capability, as many spells (planar binding/gate) can all be used to summon unique creatures of much rarer and impressive power.


 * As for the method of creation it was a known process by josidiah (hence knowing that she would be killed), who himself confessed not knowing much about enchanting items....even going as far to say that there are many such items in the world. Anders was after all basing the item on a similar figurine that he and his mentor had used before.


 * The uniqueness of the statue is not the magic invloved or its creation...but the creature it summons.--Eli the Tanner 01:33, August 14, 2011 (UTC)


 * On the contrary, it was Anders Beltgarden who created Guenhwyvar (or at least prepared the materials for the enspelling), and he was quite skilled at enchantment. Also, as he says early in the story, the creation of the statuette requires the death of the animal, which never happened. Here is a quote from "Guenhwyvar", following the statuette's creation:


 * ""How did you do this?" the elf asked.

"I know not," Anders replied. "And I do not even know what I, what we, have done, with the figurine. It is the statuette that transforms into the living beast, and yet, the cat is here, and so is the statuette!" The old mage chuckled, locking gazes with the elf. "Send her away to heal," he bade.

...

"That is the joy of magic," Anders said. "The mystery of it all. Why, even the greatest wizards could not explain this, I should guess. Perhaps all of my preparation, perhaps the magic of the hole - ah, yes, my dear, lost hole! - perhaps the combination of all these things."


 * That quote clearly shows that it is something beyond the common figurine of wondrous power. Guenhwyvar shows signs of sentience and her own motivations (disobeying a direct command from Masoj Hun'ett), and (since the two were there at the time of its creation have no idea how it was accomplished) its "creation or existence can't be explained by the normal laws of magic". Cronje (talk &sdot; contribs) 02:19, August 14, 2011 (UTC)


 * I say go with 4th Edition Artifact. Guenhwyvar is definitely unique and powerful. And she can't be destroyed unless there is the case of planar gates and rips, which are definitely beyond normal means of magic. Drow2626 03:00, August 14, 2011 (UTC)

Obviously, it will be impossible to say for a fact what kind of item Guenhwyvar in fact is. After all your talking about an item that has been described in every edition of D&D from 1E to 4E. And it's a bit clumsy to say Guenhwyvar was one type of item and then 'spontaneously' changed into another item type, and explain that out three times.

How about we just go with ''Guenhwyvar is a unique magic item, and leave it at that.(Bloodtide 13:56, August 14, 2011 (UTC))


 * The consensus I seek isn't necessarily for wiki classification (though if her statuette is an artifact, I think she should be classified as such, for when people visit Category:Artifacts), but also because it bugs me personally. Her statuette is a figurine of wondrous power, in that it's a figurine and that it holds wondrous power, but I think the method of her creation and the powers granted by her becoming bound to the statuette should classify her as a true, albeit minor, artifact. Cronje (talk &sdot; contribs) 23:38, August 14, 2011 (UTC)