Talk:Mystra

Contradiction
Contradiction: at the beginning Mystryl's alignment is noted as LN, further in text it's CN. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.172.28.236 (talk • contribs)


 * Mystryl is in fact CN, but Mystra (the first incarnation) is LN, and Midnight/Mystra (the second incarnation) is NG. 22:29, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

I could be wrong, but isn't the circle of stars and crimson mist specifically the symbol of the second Mystra? Representing the new constelation that appeared when she gained her godhood.

Yes, the first Mystra's symbol was simply a blue white star. (Bloodtide 02:03, June 25, 2011 (UTC))

The picture of the symbol shows an eight pointed star, I think it should be seven pointed, or am I wrong? 212.8.130.191 11:19, November 22, 2013 (UTC)


 * Various sources describe it differently. I'll be able to be more specific when I get home to my books. The 8-pointed star shown in the article is a rendering of the symbol shown in
 * which is one of the first mentions of this Mystra (the one before Midnight).&mdash;Moviesign (talk) 15:42, November 22, 2013 (UTC)

The Evolution of Mystra's Symbol
Here's everything I have on the various symbols of the Goddess of Magic: Sorry, no 7-pointed star that I can find. &mdash;Moviesign (talk) 01:48, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
 * Mystryl
 * "A single blue-white star"
 * No official-looking graphical representations.
 * Mystra
 * "A blue-white star"
 * The graphical representation used in this article: an 8-pointed star in union with a circle crossing each point.
 * "A blue-white star before the coming of the Avatars"
 * Mystra (Midnight)
 * "A circle of stars in a ring, with a red mist rising towards (or flowing from) the center."
 * Graphic of eight 5-pointed stars in a circle with mist reaching the center of the circle.
 * "A circle of nine stars, with a red mist rising toward (or flowing from) its center or a circle of seven blue-white stars, or (older) a single blue-white star." Note the contradiction: "circle of nine" or "circle of seven" stars when the graphic clearly shows eight.
 * "Circle of seven blue-white stars with red mist flowing from the center"
 * Graphic showing seven of the 8-pointed star-circles described above for Mystra, arranged unsymmetrically in a circle with three on each side and one brighter star at the top. The red mist reaches all the way up to the top star (i.e., not flowing from the center as the text describes).

Mystra's Current Status
What is Mystra's current status as a deity? She certainly isn't truly dead because Elminster spoke with her in Cormyr. It seems Mystra's power is similar to that of an Exarch but the only recent sources on Mystra are from Ed Greenwood's novels which tend to be vague. Boo Too - &quot;Go for the eyes!&quot; 22:40, September 25, 2011 (UTC)


 * This mystra is dead as far as I can tell. Midnight may not be. &mdash;Moviesign (talk) 19:39, October 10, 2013 (UTC)


 * I can't in this wiki any reference to Mystra from the books of the Empyrean Odyssey trilogy (where she was slain). What is the connection to the F.R. world and other books? Can someone more knowledgeable then me update the reference? (AH)


 * For starters, you are looking at the wrong Mystra. You want the Mystra (Midnight) article where it briefly discusses her death and subsequent resurrection. If you have more to add, please do. You can also expand on the plot synopsis in any of the articles dealing with the The Empyrean Odyssey trilogy. Enjoy! &mdash;Moviesign (talk) 01:16, May 1, 2014 (UTC)

Novels vs. Adventures
Most of the later history of Mystra in this artcle is based on Shadowdale (adventure) and not Shadowdale (novel). I don't know what the differences are between the two stories because I don't own the novels, but they at least arrive at the same conclusion. Anyone care to comment on how this article reads and how it presents the story relative to the novels? Feel free to add "alternate history" to this article if you feel it's necessary. For this same reason, I'm not sure how well I can fix up the Midnight page when it comes to novel vs. adventure sources. &mdash;Moviesign (talk) 19:39, October 10, 2013 (UTC)


 * I haven't checked out the adventure, but as I recall, the article pretty much describes the events of the novel. — BadCatMan (talk) 13:29, October 21, 2013 (UTC)

Comments for Featured Article status
Here is some critique regarding this article's nomination for featured article-hood.

There's a fair bit more to say about her history, naturally. Mystra appears heavily in Elminster: The Making of a Mage, with her in human guise and as a goddess, and her close relationship with Elminster, and probably in some early other Greenwood novels.

Some of the dot-pointed history could be expanded, with more of what appeared in Relationships (repeated to some degree). The bit about the temple in Waterdeep in 1215 DR doesn't seem necessary to the Mystra article, and more suited to church of Mystra. I think the pre-Troubles line would fit better amongst the following ToT history.

The portraits in the Gallery don't seem too relevant to Mystra. Midnight, maybe, but not the rest. — BadCatMan (talk) 13:29, October 21, 2013 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I figured DW was being too generous when he suggested this might be a featured article. So this is about as far as I can take it with the sources I have available. Perhaps someone will pick it up from here and run with it. I doubt I can give Midnight a thorough treatment for the same reason. &mdash;Moviesign (talk) 16:35, October 21, 2013 (UTC)

Higher edition stats
More Mystra vs. Midnight questions: Shouldn't the stats for 5th edition be moved to the Mystra (Midnight) article, looking at both the timeframe and the alignment? And does it make sense to have the 4th edition info based on 2E adventure? - Sure this Mystra is dead within the 4th edition timeframe, but wouldn't that need a 4E source also? Daranios (talk) 19:16, January 17, 2018 (UTC)


 * Yes, this article should probably end with the 2e info for the second goddess of magic and pick up in the Midnight page with 3e, 4e, and 5e stats and story. &mdash;Moviesign (talk) 14:17, January 18, 2018 (UTC)

Inaccurate Citation
At the end of the Personality section it says, "Toward the end of her reign as the keeper of the Weave, she had grown cynical and bitter..." This paragraph misrepresents the text cited in the link, especially the choice of the word Cynical. The original text says that Mystra is tired and bitter. This gives the impression that she has been a goddess for a really long time and is simply fed up with how often she has had to defend herself, as opposed to the view of a hateful, distrustful goddess given by the word cynical.

Here is my proposed revision:

"The importance of her portfolio had made Mystra a popular target for the attacks and schemes of many powerful beings over the ages. Mystra had grown tired and bitter; only her pride and the kindnesses of those who did not worship or aid her for magical gain, kept her going."

Here is the original text:

"The importance of her portfolio has made her a popular target for the attacks and schemes of many powerful beings over the ages. Mystra has grown tired and bitter; only her pride, and the kindnesses of those who do not worship or aid her for magical gain, keeps her going. Perhaps it is time for a new Mistress of Magic to rise, allowing Mystra to slumber, her essence scattered throughout many beings and items of the Realms, in quiet support of a new goddess of the Art." (Shadowdale TSR09247, page 42)

Cloudcasterv (talk) 01:39, April 19, 2018 (UTC)


 * Okay, thank you for clarifying. However, only the one word needed to be changed, not the whole paragraph, which otherwise conveys the same meaning and information. I have changed "cynical" to "tired".


 * Furthermore, your revision is exactly the same as the source text, and changing to past tense doesn't alter that. Please note we don't accept copied text. — BadCatMan (talk) 01:54, April 19, 2018 (UTC)


 * Fair enough. Thanks for your understanding. This's the first big edit I've done on a Wiki. I figured that if I was confused by this, I didn't want anybody else to be as well.
 * Thanks again.
 * Cloudcasterv (talk) 02:03, April 19, 2018 (UTC)


 * The use of "cynical" in that sentence was intended to mean (from dictionary.com) "distrusting or disparaging the motives of others" which, I feel, accurately characterizes her feelings toward those who "worship or aid her for magical gain". It also avoids repeated use of the word "tired", which appears in the History section that deals with the same topic ("As the centuries passed, Mystra had grown tired of ..."). I know my brand of wordsmithing doesn't please everybody, but I wanted to explain the thought process behind the choice. Either word works. &mdash;Moviesign (talk) 13:23, April 19, 2018 (UTC)


 * I like the word "cynical" and have never thought it meant "hateful". I agree with Movie here and think it is a much nicer word to have than "tired". ~ Lhynard (talk) 13:43, April 19, 2018 (UTC)

Good Article status
Correct: yes

Referenced: yes

Formatted: yes

Clean: yes

Nearly complete: yes

Policy-adherent/Demonstrative: yes

Relationship with Azuth and Savras
This article claims that Mystra sponsored both to godhood so that they could help her manage her portfolio. However, Savras' article claims that, when he was a demigod and Azuth was a mortal with "godlike powers", Azuth and Savras dueled over the latter's divinity, leading to Savras being trapped in an eponymous sceptre until he was freed by Azuth in exchange for a pledge of fealty. The Savras article uses Faiths and Pantheons (2002) as the source for this, while this article uses Powers and Pantheons (1997). If both sources are considered to be canon, there should at least be a change to the language in both articles to account for the conflicting information. SpiritMan1 (talk) 08:27, 11 September 2023 (UTC)