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A discussion was started in Template talk:5th edition sourcebooks by User:Ir'revrykal about a better looking nav box for lists of books, etc. As you can see, the scroll design is not meant to handle things that are taller than they are wide, so I asked User:Thomaslove92 if he would like to design us a border image we can put on a plain old <div> tag and make it look cool. I'm happy to report that Thomaslove92 came through with a design and is looking into other styles to enhance our theme around here.

Take a look at {{Border box 01}} and {{Border box 01-dark}} for two versions of the bordered box, the first one keeps the white background and the second one fills it in with a dark background and changes the font colors to make it readable. Across the top of the box, it says "Wikia" in Dethek runes, repeated for the width of the box.

Please comment and discuss this possible new addition to our style. I will post any new designs that Thomaslove92 sends me as soon as possible.

Moviesign (talk) 23:09, February 13, 2017 (UTC)


Is this meant to replace all of the current nav. boxes?
~ Lhynard (talk) 23:52, February 13, 2017 (UTC)


That is what we are here to decide, but I would say no. This particular design has a very thick border and would not be appropriate for small applications like the {{Category jump}} we use extensively (which is based on the {{4ed box}}). I envision it for long lists of sourcebooks (which is what started this discussion in the first place) or other large conglomerations of links that strain the background gradient of the 4ed box, causing it to repeat. See {{Computer games list}}, for example.

We can certainly come up with a much thinner, more subtle border for Category jump, if you wish. That would be my preference.

Moviesign (talk) 00:57, February 14, 2017 (UTC)


Looks very cool, but perhaps a little too massive with the thick border? Looking forward to updating various navboxes to look somewhat uniform.
Ir'revrykal (talk) 06:55, February 16, 2017 (UTC)


I completely agree with Ir'revrykal: Very nice, but a bit massive. That said, I prefer the completely dark version. I am looking forward to employing a new version, as I recently had a problem with the 4ed box in combination with the skin I use.
Daranios (talk) 14:03, February 25, 2017 (UTC)


Ok, I have tweaked the original style to make the borders thinner. The top border was reduced by 25% and the left, right, and bottom borders were reduced by 50%. Look at {{Border box 01-thin}} and {{Border box 01-dark-thin}} side-by-side with the original designs and give feedback please. I like to open them in separate tabs and toggle back and forth.
Moviesign (talk) 17:59, February 25, 2017 (UTC)


I like the thinner borders of the second set. It makes the box more discreet and not dominating the page. It also reduces the area used on the screen, saving on "real estate".

I prefer the white-background versions. Bright text on dark tends to strain my eyes and leave lines across my vision, so I prefer dark text on light.

If it's not too late/tedious, can the Dethek runes read "Forgotten Realms Wiki" instead? :)
— BadCatMan (talk) 01:31, February 26, 2017 (UTC)


Here are new examples with "Forgotten Realms Wiki" in Dethek runes across the top. {{Border box 02-Lorem}}, {{Border box 02-thin}}, and {{Border box 02-dark-thin}}. When he gets time, Thomas said he will try a scroll version and perhaps some borders based on FR package art.
Moviesign (talk) 05:16, March 9, 2017 (UTC)


Movie, I liked how much each of your examples changed... for the better, of course! Hmmm, I tend to agree with BadCat... at first, I really liked the dark background... but now my vote has shifted to the dark letters and white backdrop... easier to see the links... still these are very cool... just be gentle when you try to mess with the category jump templates :)
- Darkwynters (talk) 22:49, April 7, 2017 (UTC)


Would it be possible to change the stark white background to some other light color? That way it could still be readable, but with a less "jarring" transition from heavy dark to bright white.
Ir'revrykal (talk) 05:39, April 8, 2017 (UTC)


I missed this last time. I like the Lorem example, but thin and dark-thin don't show their borders to me, only the text and a column bar.
— BadCatMan (talk) 09:36, April 8, 2017 (UTC)


That was my fault BCM, I forgot to make the change to the CSS file that is used in monobook, and now I have removed it from all the demos linked above in favor of the "winning" choice. I will try to reconstitute the demos without cluttering up the CSS file for our wiki, which is already huge.


@Ir'revrykal: I will see what I can do about giving the background a slight tint.
Moviesign (talk) 14:10, April 8, 2017 (UTC)


Ok, I have added a tint to the background of the new border box. It is a light shade of the gold band found in the border itself, and it corresponds nicely with the colors used in our background image. If you think it is too dark, I can go one shade lighter.

EDIT: Oops, the color shows up outside the border. I have more work to do...

EDIT the second: Ok, fixed now. If you don't like the color, make suggestions.
Moviesign (talk) 14:38, April 8, 2017 (UTC)


I like it! Thank you for putting all this together.
Ir'revrykal (talk) 15:16, April 8, 2017 (UTC)


By the way, it doesn't seem to work properly with Monobook.
Ir'revrykal (talk) 11:27, April 10, 2017 (UTC)


I'm still futzing with it, but I have synced up Monobook to the current styles. Clear your cache to see the change and let me know if anything breaks or looks bad.
Moviesign (talk) 13:41, April 10, 2017 (UTC)


The table seems to align to the left in Monobook now, creating a large empty space. Example
Ir'revrykal (talk) 08:21, April 17, 2017 (UTC)


Oh, you have an extra-wide screen. I'll see if I can fix that.
Moviesign (talk) 16:22, April 17, 2017 (UTC)


Ok, I have updated the style and fixed a few things so your {{5th edition sourcebooks}} should look good in both Oasis and Monobook. It is supposed to align to the left, but now the gap on the right is filled in with color. In general, I think {{Border box}} can be used to replace {{4ed box}} for most bottom-of-the-page navigation boxes. The same styles can be used in both types of nav boxes (table and template) and I will write up some documentation explaining how. I think 4ed box might be used in a few places where the Border box would not look good, but I going on memory until I look into it.
Moviesign (talk) 03:25, April 18, 2017 (UTC)
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